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Old March 12th, 2009, 01:04 PM
resistanceisfruitful resistanceisfruitful is offline
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Default glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Glutathione deficiency is a well documented condition in those with immune deficiency, cancer, MS and other chronic conditions. There's quite a bit of discussion about this in the AME archives as well.

The information I've found about supplementing, however, is confusing.

I have been using glutamine powder (a precursor to glutathione) supplementation intermittently for several years on the advice of an allopathic HIV specialist. Other references recommend another precursor, n-acetyl cycteine (NAC) for supplementation, which I've also been using the last two years. Acetyl l-carnitine (ALCAR) is yet another glutathione "booster" that is in my oversized list of supplements.

Needless to say, I'd like to reduce the quantities of supplements I'm taking.

Apparently taking glutathione itself orally is not very effective, due to low absorption rates in the digestive tract. There are some sublingual glutathione products available, but I'm not sure how they compare for dosing.

Does anyone have any additional information about the best supplement to counter glutathione deficiency? Are there other reasons to take NAC and carnitine besides glutathione deficiency?
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Old March 13th, 2009, 10:04 PM
LivingWell LivingWell is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Dear Resistance is Fruitful;
I saw your question about glutathione and I am happy to answer your questions. There are many ways to raise and sustain intracellular glutathione. The best clinically proven way to do so is by supplying bonded cysteine to the cells. This will combine with glycine and glutamic acid, which is plentiful in our diet, to make glutathione in the cell.
This in turn has a marked effect on several disease states, including the suppression of HIV. Would you like to know more?

LivingWell
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Old March 13th, 2009, 10:47 PM
resistanceisfruitful resistanceisfruitful is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Quote:
Originally Posted by LivingWell View Post
Would you like to know more?
Gee, LW. I sure would, but last time I heard an invitation like yours I ended up at an Amway meeting, so you're credibility gets one ding right there.

I see from your profile that your a "wellness consultant". Ding ding.

I'm sure you're not using AME to solicit business now, are you?

Ding ding ding.
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Old March 14th, 2009, 01:46 AM
LivingWell LivingWell is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Dear Resistance;
I appreciate your concerns. Actually my purpose in writing is to provide useful information to those that are asking. Did you find my answer helpful and informative?

No dings here!

LW
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Old March 14th, 2009, 03:42 AM
resistanceisfruitful resistanceisfruitful is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Sorry if I jumped to conclusions, but I thought my question was pretty clear: Which supplement is the best way to boost glutathione levels. You said:"The best clinically proven way to do so is by supplying bonded cysteine to the cells."

Your answer begs the next question, how does one best supply bonded cysteine to the cells? Oral NAC? IV glutathione? Rebounding upside down after lunch?

Your incomplete answer, followed by asking me if I wanted to know more struck me as odd, to say the least, and not really helpful, but I'd love to hear more if you can help. It might even benefit others here.
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Old March 14th, 2009, 04:53 PM
LivingWell LivingWell is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Dear Resistance,
Good morning! I am happy to answer your further questions. N-acetyl Cysteine is a variant of the amino acid L-cysteine, with an "acetyl" molecule attached. It does an excellent job of raising glutathione, especially in emergency situations in case of a drug overdose to save a person's liver and their life. But in smaller every day doses, many report that it tastes and smells bad, and since it is an over the counter drug, can have toxic side effects. It also has a short half life, so has to be taken several times a day. What has your experience been with NAC?

You are correct that oral glutathione is not absorbed well. Intravenous glutathione is another excellent way to get GSH into the system, but this too has a short half life, and ends up in the blood serum but not the lymphocytes where you really need it to boost your immune system and boost T cell production. It is also expensive and invasive.
You seem to be well read on GSH , and so I would like to ask if you have read the excellent handbook on GSH that Dr. Jimmy Gutman wrote. I have no commercial interest in the book, but this book will answer all your questions about the various ways to raise glutathione. It is entitled "Glutathione- Your Key to Health" .
Bonded cysteine which I mentioned earlier is two cysteine molecules bonded together with a sulfur molecule. It is bioactive and thermolabile. This enables the cysteine to survive the digestive process and enter the cell intact where it can become the precursor for GSH. Bonded cysteine is in mother's breast milk, so after we are weaned this is no longer available to us. It is also found in raw meat, raw milk, and raw eggs, and in small amounts in raw vegetables. Since these foods are not plentiful in our diet nowadays, it is difficult to obtain enough. If you would like to learn more about this, you can find the answers you seek within the pages of Dr. Jimmy Gutman's book. You should be able to find it online at a bookstore.

If I can be of further assistance to you, please do not hesitate to ask. I am happy to help. I know you will find the book a great read. This is where I learned much of what I shared with you above.

Sincerely,
LivingWell
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Old March 14th, 2009, 06:42 PM
resistanceisfruitful resistanceisfruitful is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Quote:
Originally Posted by LivingWell View Post
N-acetyl Cysteine is a variant of the amino acid L-cysteine, with an "acetyl" molecule attached. It does an excellent job of raising glutathione, especially in emergency situations in case of a drug overdose to save a person's liver and their life. But in smaller every day doses, many report that it tastes and smells bad, and since it is an over the counter drug, can have toxic side effects. It also has a short half life, so has to be taken several times a day. What has your experience been with NAC?
I have been taking 1000 mg NAC 3x day for the last year or so. I could make that 4x day, but taking anything more frequently than that is a bit hit on the doability scale.

I also take 1 tblspoon (forget what the metric equivalence is) of l-glutamine powder 2x day. That has been a recommendation of my allopathic doc for some time, though I haven't always been as compliant as I have been the last year or so. He recommends it as a means to improve body composition values.

I will followup your lead for the book and see what I can learn there. I see bonded csyteine is available as a nutritional supplement. Adding it to my current regimen seems reduntant. What I'm really trying to determine is if I can supplement with a single form, rather than two or three different ones. Should I consider switching the NAC for a bonded cysteine product. Keep or drop the l-glutamine?

Glutathione and selenium deficiencies seem to be almost universally accepted as contributors to immune disorders. Supplementation is supported by those in the natural wellness fields, as well as the mainstream.

For those people trying to address health problems with their immune systems without pharmaceutical intervention, they should probably be at the top of any list for supplementation.

Again LW, I regret my premature cross words earlier in this thread and thank you for the information.
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Old March 14th, 2009, 08:26 PM
resistanceisfruitful resistanceisfruitful is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

LivingWell:

Do you have any relationship with Immunocal or Immunotec?
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Old March 14th, 2009, 09:00 PM
LivingWell LivingWell is offline
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Default Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Dear Resistance;

I understand your concerns and your question about what you should do. I believe that Dr. Gutman's book will clear it up for you. I just did a quick search online, and see that this latest edition of his book is unavailable. I bought my copy directly from his office a few months ago and thought it was available elsewhere by now. But he has written four editions of this book, and one of the older ones which is available for less than $10 will still have the information you need to make this decision. This latest edition just has some newer medical studies included in it, but the third edition is still an excellent resource. The third edition which is entitled "GSH Your body's most powerful protector" is available at amazon.com for $7.50 and up used and new.

As with any health care decision, you should make an informed choice. This book will give you all the choices available to you, and then perhaps you can discuss these options with your physician.

If you would like to know my personal opinion, and that is all it is, about what you should do regarding your specific questions, here are my observations. You mention you have to take NAC several times a day. I know how difficult that can be, and I hear what you are saying about going from 3-4 times a day- hard to maintain a routine of that day in and day out. Ideally you would like to take one supplement once a day and forget it. I understand that L-glutamine or glutamic acid, which is one of the three precursors for glutathione, is plentiful in the diet, so am not sure if you need to be taking an L-Glutamine supplement. If you were to decide to skip all of the glutathione precursors and choose one, then I would choose bonded cysteine. It can be taken once a day and stays in your system longer. It looks like from your own research you see that it is available. There is one supplement that is listed in the Physician's Desk Reference and is covered for certain conditions in certain states by Medicare and Medicaid. There is a possibility that it would be covered for you if you decide to take it. If you want to know more specifically about this, please send me an e-mail at my address: Laura@ImmuneHealthSolutions.com. We can talk more there, and again, I promise I am here to provide helpful information, and likely someone else will benefit from this besides myself, but I will be happy knowing that I have pointed you in the right direction.

I just saw your last question- and yes I am a consultant with Immunotec. The company is a biotechnical research firm out of Montreal , Quebec, and they have given me an excellent education on the topic of glutathione up- regulation. Please keep in mind that if you are able to get Immunocal through Medicare or Medicaid I would not benefit at all. You would be able to order it directly through Immunotec's medical division. Your doctor should be able to prescribe it for you since it is listed in the PDR. If you would like access to the medical studies available and specific patents on the subject of boosting immunity, I can also direct you to those as well.

Again the book which covers all methods of raising GSH will give you the most rounded out picture. If you desire more info on Immunocal, I can help you to make sure that you get the right information and prescription for your specific situation.

Congratulations on what you have learned so far on the subject of glutathione. The more I learn about this amazing substance in each of our cells, the more I am amazed. Glutathione's job in the cells goes way beyond boosting immunity. I know your search for answers will be well rewarded. And again thank you for giving me the opportunity to share with you. I find the sharing of valuable information with those who search for it the most important thing I can do in life.

With you in good health,
LivingWell
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Old March 15th, 2009, 02:58 AM
resistanceisfruitful resistanceisfruitful is offline
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Thumbs down Re: glutamine vs nac vs glutathione supplementation

Quote:
Originally Posted by LivingWell View Post

I just saw your last question- and yes I am a consultant with Immunotec.
So my ding ding ding warning bells of an approaching opportunist were right after all. You are a piece of work, aren't you? A "consultant" who just happens to be taking advantage of an "opportunity", right?

I won't say Immunocal is a scam. One of the less expensive brands of undenatured whey protein may be worth considering in lieu of NAC and l-glutamine, from I've seen so far.

Spare us the defense and sales pitch. Years of research... Patents... Canadian certification as a natural product...

Yawn.

There's also the affiliated marketing spiel. "Opportunity" or "Attend a meeting" with one of Immunotec's "Executive Diamond Consultants". One of your fellow "consultants" (unless it's your site) actually promotes Zig Ziglar seminars! I think I mentioned Amway in my first response and I was spot on, wasn't I?

It's also a very interesting coincidence that you chose to join AME the day after I posted my question. I knew that this new site would be indexed for the search engines, and you're living proof that works pretty well, I'd say.

Thanks for your concern and advice, and yes, even some new information, but why the stealth approach? Why didn't you just come into the forum and state clearly and plainly what your intentions were if your product and company are legit and above board?

You have lost what little credibility you had managed to build with me at this point. I don't purchase "products" from multilevel marketing scammers. The tone and style of your posts was a dead give away, yet I gave you the benefit of the doubt.

I would encourage anyone reading this thread to check the links above and do your own research before buying Immunocal or doing business with this company or its "consultants".

I am still optimistically researching the value of undenatured whey protein as a means of boosting glutathione levels. There's some more information about that here, but I'm not endorsing or recommending this supplement. Does anyone else use any form of it?
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