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View Full Version : HIV Reservoirs in the Brain - Hmmm....



justice_for_all
September 23rd, 2009, 11:47 PM
From the land "Downunder":

'Reservoir' for HIV found in the brain - Yahoo!7 News (http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/latest/6094765/reservoir-for-hiv-found-in-the-brain/)

Now "HIV" is the leading cause of dementia in those under 40 years of age. Good to know, isn't it? This has to be far beyond Junk Science and in its own category.

G Man
September 24th, 2009, 12:06 AM
Sounds like nothing more than additional hogwash to add to their repertoire of so called 'scientific findings'. The amount of bullshit out there never ceases to amaze me. They keep coming up with crap like this to take the debate away from the most important fact of whether HIV really does anything at all. The media's behavior with regard to HIV/AIDS has been utterly DEPLORABLE. They're not much good on any other subject either, so really it's not a surprise.

StarZ
September 27th, 2009, 12:51 AM
This is the same as the senior metal decline on the rise....ever since they have been drugged up and pumped full of cholestarol reducing drugs from the age of 40. Your brain is all fat, how can it survive if ARVs reduce people to skeletal outlines within months and motor functions to a quiver! Tell me another one, not letting them tell me I am crazy...and poz, one at a time please!

moonchild493
September 27th, 2009, 01:54 AM
I know there must be people who lose weight on ARVs, but I didn't get back on them till I had lost, oh, 70 pounds trying to do all the natural stuff. It wasn't till I got on the drugs again that I regained my appetite and considerably more of the weight I had lost than I would have liked. Broad, sweeping statements do not necessarily serve the common good. We are all different. I was very, very sick and I got better on the drugs. The time may come when that is not the case, but right now it is very far away and I will deal with it when and if it is necessary.

Linda

shrell
September 30th, 2009, 08:17 AM
So, are you saying that those drugs works wonders for you ? and that you believe HIV=AIDS theory ?


I know there must be people who lose weight on ARVs, but I didn't get back on them till I had lost, oh, 70 pounds trying to do all the natural stuff. It wasn't till I got on the drugs again that I regained my appetite and considerably more of the weight I had lost than I would have liked. Broad, sweeping statements do not necessarily serve the common good. We are all different. I was very, very sick and I got better on the drugs. The time may come when that is not the case, but right now it is very far away and I will deal with it when and if it is necessary.

Linda

moonchild493
September 30th, 2009, 10:39 PM
Shrell,

All I can say is aaarrrggghhhh! I have stated over and over that I do not believe hiv causes aids. I doubt highly that a virus, innocuous or not exists. I consider myself a die-hard dissident, although some here may argue that. When I went off the drugs in 2005, I was totally convinced all would be well. Alas, it wasn't. Over the next 2 years I got sicker and sicker until I could barely walk or breathe. In desperation, and with little hope it would do any good, I went back to the ID doc, who put me on Atripla. I began to get better within a week or so. I theorize that there is something auto-immune going on in my body (hence all the antibodies to all sorts of things) and that the drugs suppress something in my immune system that is running amok.

If you want my whole sordid story, google Liam Scheff and check out the blog entry entitled "When did you first become positive?" As far as I know, it's the next-to-last post. Trust me, I didn't plan it this way, and I had no expectations of the drugs working, so I don't think you can attribute my recovery to anything mental or a placebo effect. I'm just telling my personal story in hopes that there's someone out there that it can help and that it might cause some dissidents to question some of what has become dissident orthodoxy. I don't claim to be typical, and I would give anything to live out my life drug-free. That's it. I still hope to try quitting the drug in the not-to-distant future and I will monitor things like liver enzymes to make sure they're not doing me real harm. I hate being somewhat sucked back into the "aids zone", but it seems inevitable at this time.

I hope I have answered your questions, and I will do my best to answer any others you or anyone has. There is just so much that is not yet understood.

Linda

HansSelyeWasCorrect
October 1st, 2009, 04:58 AM
Linda:

It's possible that the "medicine" did "benefit" you, at least in the short term, but notions about viruses in this context are silly, even if the viruses were real. Have you read the "Osler's Web" book. After I read it, as well as "When AIDS Began" (along with all my other reading/research), I came to conclude that a good generalization would be that "HIV/AIDS" is nonsense but "CFS" is real, which is the exact opposite of what most "experts" thought back in the 1980s. Let me be clear, though. By "CFS," I mean a hyperactive/hypersensitive immune/inflammatory response that lasts months or years. This can cause various "dementia"-like conditions. Over time, the immune system can get exhausted, and then an "AIDS"-like condition can occur (if the person is still alive and did not recover). Many "AIDS cases" were likely "CFS," but most of these people were likely killed by the AZT, if they took it as originally prescribed.

As to your situation, I have no idea what the drugs are doing to your body. If I were you, I'd want levels of all the apparently important molecules tested for regularly. Do you know if you have excessive cytokine production? Has a doctor told you that your immune system is anergic? The problem with just measuring CD4 cells is that there is no way to know what to do, regardless of the finding. If I knew that my CD4s were low and my cytokines were very high, I would do certain things. In addition, unless you get these things measured frequently, it's just a "snapshot" and could simply mean you breathed in too many fumes from a truck you were stuck behind in traffic one day.

As to notions of "reservoirs," so what? The body stores up dangerous metals if you have too much (this is what "age spots" are - iron). The key has to do with whether the particles are involved in detrimental biochemical reactions. If they are, there is usually something simple you can do to reverse it (though if you let it go too long you can allow irreversible damage to tissue or organs to occur, of course). Anything can be dangerous in excess, such as drinking too much water, which has actually killed people who thought they were doing the right thing. If there are too many particles in the body, they will either be attacked by the immune system or not. If not, they can cause tissue or organ failure or dysfunction eventually. The "HIV" idea doesn't make sense. The body can adapt and produce more CD4 cells. In fact, Janine Roberts quotes an "HIV/AIDS expert" who states that "HIV" only destroys around 5% of these cells. Only a body that is just about dead wouldn't be able to compensate for that !

EDIT: Towards the end of "Osler's Web," the point is made that "CFS" appears to be identical to "interferon toxicity." It's a shame that our medical system is focused on finding a "germ," when in fact the body is actually damaging itself, and the only explanation that makes sense to me is that the great upsurge in various "diseases" by the 1980s is related to diet, as the use of soybean oil rose tremendously, starting in the early 1960s (there was a graph showing this on the CNN special, "America's Killer Diet," though they didn't appear to understand the implications, which are that by the 1980s, a generation of people, the first in human history in a large-scale society, had arachidonic acid in their cells, and this makes the body much more biochemically active/unstable and thus susceptible to these "diseases" - the molecular-level evidence is now clear and abundant on this point).

T.rex
October 2nd, 2009, 07:03 PM
i think people under extreme stress and depression suffer from mental impairment, as a result. Short term memory loss, confusion, sluggish thinking... these are things all attributed to hiv dementia, however, i think in many cases a much more benign cause is the at the root of it.

moonchild493
October 2nd, 2009, 11:40 PM
Hans,

No, I haven't read Osler's Web. Got the author's name offhand? I just asked you on another thread about measuring cytokines. I think that might be something I want to do. I don't know anything about anergic stuff -- can you elaborate?

I have a friend with whom I have not been in touch lately who apparently suffers from CFS. I don't know all the details, but I belief she was a chemist of some kind and got thyroid cancer, for which I assume she had conventional treatment. .strangely enough, she worked for a homeopath who claimed to have reversed hiv patients back to negative, and there was much talk about CFS and AIDS being basically the same think but just different gradations. I think I need to try to contact her again and get some details.

Linda

BamainAtlanta
October 3rd, 2009, 03:16 AM
Linda,

I think your theory about auto immunity is plausible. If there are different kinds of AIDS, then it makes sense that HAART would tear some people up and build up others. Those who are primarily immune deficient would not benefit as much as those who have overactive immune systems. I think it is important for all of us to really listen to people like yourself. Somone with autoimmunity may need drugs, at least for a period of time, that can suppress the immune system. I think what makes AIDS so complicated is that most people are probably a mix of the two types once they start to develop symptoms.

IMMichaelG
October 3rd, 2009, 03:47 AM
The other factor that I think all should remember is that we ultimately do not know if the drugs play any factor at all in health.

The reality is that not a single hiv drug has ever been tried against placebo since the original 4 month short AZT trial back in the mid 80's.

Therefore, we certainly do not know if the drugs have any more benefit other than just calming and destressing the patient or perhaps giving the patient confidence and hope.

And don't kid yourselves, such things as not being stressed or having confidence or hope in good outcomes most assuredly do affect our bodily health, as does simple belief that the drugs work has an effect as well.

Though I will say this, that if any who do believe in the drugs were to be deprived of them, I myself have no doubt that either the stresses or fears or beliefs or expectations of sickness would undoubtedly, to me at least, also have a major effect on the outcome of health and well being.

Nobody, who at this point believes in the drugs, should ever be deprived of them, for it could be extremely psychologically damaging, and would also therefore be physically damaging, as our psychology, beliefs, expectations, and emotional states are most assuredly also tied in to our physical well being as well.

Note also, that the toxicity of any drugs varies from person to person, and is assuredly affected by such variable as emotional states, beliefs, age, and many other factors as well.

One person can eat a box of rat poison and survive with no problem and be just fine, and the next can take an aspirin or overly potent vitamin and kick over dead from it. All of us are very different with many and various things going on internally, including various degrees of toxic emotions, stresses, ways of dealing with stress, prior physical damage from other toxic factors, genetics, as well as many other factors.

There is a lot going on here and it differs from one to the next, and even though we all might want to try to over-simplifiy it into a one-size fits all thing, this is a mistake, and it is not possible as our perspectives and knowledge base is simply limited to nothing more than our perceptions and gut instincts and beliefs.

I feel confident that when it comes to drugs, drug effects, benefits and toxicities, one size absolutely does not fit all, and all have to stumble through it on their own, in the dark, and pay their own price or reap their own rewards for whatever choices or courses of actions they do take.

Michael

HansSelyeWasCorrect
October 3rd, 2009, 04:06 AM
I posted about cytokine tests on another thread:

"Linda: A quick google search resulted in the following:

Cytokine Panel - IL1b, IL6, IL8, TNF Alpha Blood Test (http://www.lef.org/Vitamins-Supplements/ItemLCCYT/Cytokine-Panel---IL1b-IL6-IL8-TNF-Alpha-Blood-Test.html)

Note that I have no affiliations with LEF (past or present) and have heard some negative rumors about them, but my guess is that there are other companies that offer similar (or the same) tests. Keep in mind, though, that as the disease process progresses, you can go from too much of one kind to too much of another one that has opposing effects. This is why my main concern is getting to the root cause of the problem."

Also, Hillary Johnson is the author of "Osler's Web." It's a great mystery story, but it also has some technical information, and of course you can then look up whatever you don't understand on the internet. I created a thread on my site with some evidence I found that supports the idea of a "hyperactive" immune response being the initial culprit (though the dietary fatty acids may be why there is more susceptibility to this hyperactivity since the late 1970s) The thread is at: The Scientific Debate Forum (http://thescientificdebateforum.aimoo.com/Non-infectious-disease/The-Chronic-Fatigue-Syndrome-thread-1-640694.html)

moonchild493
October 4th, 2009, 12:49 AM
Bama,

It was Matt Irwin who first theorized that I had something auto-immune or allergic, and I greatly respect his opinion. I guess the hard part is figuring out what it is and how best to deal with it. I tried LDN for a few months but doubt I'll renew it since it didn't seem to do anything.

Michael,

I get your point. The first time around, I guess I expected the drugs to work because I didn't know anything but the orthodox perspective. However, I really expected to be fine off them and I wasn't. Unless there is something going on way below my conscious mind, I can't explain that. And I certainly didn't expect to begin recovering almost immediately upon resuming the drugs, albeit a different kind. I didn't believe what was going on with me could be helped in any way by ARVs, at least consciously.

Hans,

Thanks for the info. Those tests are expensive! I doubt I'll be able to get them unless they can be done through my insurance. I've had pretty good luck talking doctors into doing the tests I want, so I'll give that a shot. And I'll check into the book.

I appreciate all the input.

Linda

IMMichaelG
October 4th, 2009, 01:19 AM
Hi Linda,

You said: "Unless there is something going on way below my conscious mind, I can't explain that".

That is one of the things that your own inner consciousness can clarify for you, if you are open to the answer.

It might be helpful to you to consider the following in "energetic" terms and analogies:

We are all like data terminals plugged into the all that is, that really does know, and can answer questions such as that provided we sincerely ask the question, and are willing to put our own ego's aside upon receiving the answer, and that we are willing to accept the answer, even if it is humbling or humiliating to our own inner ego. Upon reaching such a moment of humility, immediately forgive yourself and all others who were involved.

The difficulty in perceiving the answers to such inner questions is because the ego rebels against any and all such information that it itself is the cause and the source of any problem, and it resists any such moments of humility, as ego dissolves away in such moments of clarity and higher perceptions.

You may find it helpful to go over in your own mind the emotions and resistant positions that you were experiencing prior to becoming ill, and particularly any and all that were emotionally painful. These things could have to do with anger and resentment at your ex, or intense moments of fear or grief or guilt, and any other "feelings" that you can remember that simply "felt" bad as you now look back and remember how you had experienced them. If they "felt bad", they were harmful to your natural state of "well-being". Anything or any egoic or mental positionalities that harm your natural state of well being will contribute to eventual illness. It is exactly such states that are like holes in the cupful of life energy that you are given every day. Enough holes in that cup, and eventually you are not taking in enough life to sustain your normal state of well being.

With practice, it becomes easier and easier to take notice of such harmful states of emotion, and to reach states of acceptance and humility for the part that we ourselves played in these life dramas. The sooner we can do so, the more life energy we ourselves retain to keep our own bodies healthy and our lives vibrant. Often, the cure for some if not all of the emotional drains is to simply continue to be loving and to understand that all are actually doing the best they can with what they themselves have to work with at any given time. Love, which itself is a spiritual level of perceiving reality from, recontextualizes all problems that it is applied to, and a state of love does not see in terms of right or wrong or good and bad. It simply sees that other choices and options for ones self and for others are available, and intends to choose them over the less accepting and less tolerant choices the next time. You know why? Because it hurts too much, and hurts both ones own self as well as others not to.

Michael

moonchild493
October 6th, 2009, 12:03 PM
Thanks, Miichael. I think perhaps you should write a book! I confess that I have a hard time wrapping my mind around some of your concepts. Late-onset ADD, perhaps. But I recognize the profundity. I think perhaps it's time to get serious about counseling. I don't think I can embark on this journey alone. I don't have the discipline.

I will say that, in the last several days while caring for my sick grandson, my fatigue seems to have greatly abated. I think maybe I need more of a purpose, which probably should have been obvious to me all along. Or maybe I have finally recovered from that odd bout of diarrhea that left me so wiped out. Or both.

I thank you for all the time and effort and thought you've expended, and intend to go back over everything you've written to be sure I'm gleaning all I can from it. I'm really glad you're participating here.

Linda

quyenbigbang
October 6th, 2009, 12:57 PM
Dear Linda,

I'm speaking from experience. 20 years ago, my 70 year old granma have a lot of test done and the doctor told my family that she'll be dead soon. She had liver cirrhosis, her artery walls were very hardened and her body can no longer cope with the environment, there's nothing he can do.

20 years later, now in her 90, now my granma is still around, yelling at kids and doing great. She has not taken any expensive life saving medicine or gone on any special diet. In fact, she ate as basic as you can get and deny any expensive food. My mom only occasionally give her some herbal tea when the weather is getting a little bit wet. Whenver my aunt took her to the hospital, she'll be sicker so my mom always oppose to that. I guess what keeps her going all these years is the fact that she look after a lot of my family (which is annoying to me sometimes as she can be very invasive).

So yeah, keep up your spirit and go around take care of your kids. I hope 20 years later you can look back and see how silly all the docs and the test told you.

Regard

Quyen

IMMichaelG
October 6th, 2009, 05:30 PM
Thanks Linda,

Again, I would suggest you consider to get a copy of Carolyn Myss phenomenal work "Anatomy of the Spirit", and also perhaps her book "Why people don't heal, and how they can".

A true understanding of such things comes only from making a choice to have intention and willingness to understand highest truths, and also, from then experiencing life from new perspectives of those higher truths we encounter.

Otherwise, we end up just doing what we are currently programmed with. But the definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over and expecting different results.

Doing anything differently or growing from where we are presently perceiving reality takes courage and willingness to overcome the intense resistance of our own ego, which gives us every reason or finds a million other things to do instead of that which even our own inner self repeatedly tells us we could or probably even should do instead.

Michael

moonchild493
October 9th, 2009, 01:58 AM
Thanks, Michael. I appreciate your reminding me of the book(s) you suggested. I will check them out. I hope to have some time for myself once my grandson goes back to school. He seems perfectly healthy except for that
very nasty cough. Maybe tomorrow we can try a half-day.

And thanks for the support, Quyen. It is much appreciated. I had the best time going to a restaurant/bar with my daughter and son-in-law last night to eat and play trivia. I'm proud that I contributed to our 3rd place finish. Maybe they'll let me go again!

Life goes on...

Linda

StarZ
October 9th, 2009, 02:01 AM
The thing about life is you always have to keep something on the 'to do' list!

moonchild493
October 10th, 2009, 01:41 AM
In checking out Amazon, I found Caroline Myss has a new book coming out Oct. 13 called "Defy Gravity: Healing Beyond the Bounds of Reason". Could be interesting.

And yes, I suppose one does need to keep things on the to-do list, although quite often I like to look ahead and know there's absolutely nothing I am required to do! Tomorrow I have to attend a picnic (pig pickin', down here in NC) where there will be all kinds of foster families and those looking into becoming foster families. Not sure how I feel about my daughter taking in a possibly traumatized child who might have a bad effect on my noe quite easy to manage grandson! It's always something!

Linda